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[Blog] Memo to California
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Author Topic: [Blog] Memo to California  (Read 34173 times)
wodan46
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« on: November 05, 2008, 18:19:44 EST »

http://www.idrewthis.org/2008/11/memo-to-california.html

Well that's all and well about California, but what about the United States?

Edited to add link.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2008, 22:16:11 EST by FireyTiger » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2008, 18:25:08 EST »

On first reading this post, I knew something about it was rubbing me the wrong way, but I couldn't put my finger on it.  Now I know what it was:

Quote
I'm starting to think we ought to just let them have polygamy on the condition that they stay out of everyone else's damn business until the end of time.
First off, Rain should know better than to act as if Mormons (at least the vast majority) still favor polygamy.  But if they do, mistake #2 was acting as if allowing it was something to be avoided.  In a post about gay marriage, no less.  Real classy.  And this is what bugs me about the whole issue: I have seen almost no positive evidence that the people who support expanding the legal definition marriage to include same-sex couples would also, in the same stroke of the pen, expand it to include groups of more than two.

Maybe I'm only coming at this from a totally different angle because I am not, personally, gay or bisexual, but to me it's always been a freedom-of-choice issue.  That is, that we get into relationships because we choose to, and that those choices should be respected.  Yes, I know that orientation is determined by a combination of genetics and early, irreversible events in one's psychological development, and that polygamists arguably are not influenced this way.  But the key principle being defended is "Live and let live."  If we are willing to disenfranchise people based on how they choose to live, we're failing this principle, no matter what our defense.

This is why I tend to take one of my rare libertarian standpoints on this one and suggest that marriage shouldn't be a government-controlled thing in the first place.  Because ultimately, you're suggesting that people should have to conform to the government's definition of marriage, regardless of whether that definition includes you and your friends, personally, or not.  I should remind everyone here that the marriage license was invented (here in the US, at least) specifically as a way to prevent interracial couples.  Think about it.
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« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2008, 18:29:15 EST »

Well that's all and well about California, but what about the United States?

Will i much more Horrified by Flordia's one, the Eagle had a certain point, Cali, you off all people?!?
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« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2008, 18:48:16 EST »

I said it in IRC, but here it is again:

http://www.bunny-comic.com/?id=1264

Seriously. We tried it. The world didn't end. Get used to it.
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« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2008, 18:49:10 EST »

Well that's all and well about California, but what about the United States?

Will i much more Horrified by Flordia's one, the Eagle had a certain point, Cali, you off all people?!?

Florida is always doing stupid shit. Ours also got rid of common-law marriage.
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« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2008, 18:51:22 EST »

Well that's all and well about California, but what about the United States?

Will i much more Horrified by Flordia's one, the Eagle had a certain point, Cali, you off all people?!?

Florida is always doing stupid shit. Ours also got rid of common-law marriage.

hence why I said i was Horrified by Flordia, but we're not Cali
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wodan46
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« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2008, 19:07:04 EST »

Once again, shouldn't we be talking about the United States, not California and Florida?
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« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2008, 19:20:19 EST »

Once again, shouldn't we be talking about the United States, not California and Florida?

Nope. becuase in mases such "adments" do nothing to change the status quo in the state. [unnessary and only there do get the base out] Thse two are chnaging the status quo
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« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2008, 19:29:48 EST »

... mistake #2 was acting as if allowing it was something to be avoided.  In a post about gay marriage, no less.  Real classy.  And this is what bugs me about the whole issue: I have seen almost no positive evidence that the people who support expanding the legal definition marriage to include same-sex couples would also, in the same stroke of the pen, expand it to include groups of more than two.

Wow, I've never seen anyone else nail my position on marriage laws so perfectly. Not just the piece I quoted, the whole thing.

You'd think, with all the whack-job fundie groups marrying off their 14-year-old girls, the religious right would be trying to keep the government out of defining marriage.
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Himatsu
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« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2008, 19:31:01 EST »

Much like the Catholic Church, the LDS church has a long history of using their vast fortunes to throw their weight around and force others to accept the legislation of their asinine superstitions into law.
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« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2008, 19:35:54 EST »

Much like the Catholic Church, the LDS church has a long history of using their vast fortunes to throw their weight around and force others to accept the legislation of their asinine superstitions into law.

the difference is the Catholic church has gotten out of the business. The only time the do it, is over keep Confessional on the same status as lawyer and doctor privilege level.
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« Reply #11 on: November 05, 2008, 19:38:11 EST »

*comes out of hiding*

About Ahnold and Ronald - give us a break, we've got Hollywood, the great generator of illusions. We decide to elect some entertainers to public office, well, that's our business. I like to think, though, that with Reagan, we realized to keep it below national levels.

Gosh, Californians can be stupid too? I NEVER NOTICED.
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« Reply #12 on: November 05, 2008, 19:41:31 EST »

Personally, I would oppose allowing polygamy to be legal unless it also permitted women to have as many husbands as they like. The Mormon idea of polygamy--which the fundamentalists still practice illegally--is an inherently sexist arrangement that enables men to have many wives, while preventing women from having more than one husband. I believe such an unequal, sexist practice should be illegal.

I don't want to put words into Eagle's beak, but I'm reasonably sure she had the Mormon idea of traditional, King Solomon style polygamy in mind when she wrote that.
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Comrade Ogilvy
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« Reply #13 on: November 05, 2008, 19:45:51 EST »

This is my modest proposal: End all marriages. Take away all insurance and tax benefits for living with another person, make it impossible to see anybody in the hospital you haven't descended from or given birth to, end of story. It sounds harsh, but, really, no institution of government should offer free bonus prizes for living your life in a manner that they see as desirable.

Churches can go ahead and marry whoever their oppressive, culturally irrelevant dogmas say they're allowed to, and it will legally amount to bupkus, and we will all stand around and snicker about the pointlessness of it.

Oh, and just to make sure that absolutely nobody is happy with this, we'll push towards getting pop culture to drastically overpower and redefine the word "marriage" to indicate a hypothetical sex act so vulgar it incorporates cannibalism.
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« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2008, 19:48:01 EST »

Churches can go ahead and marry whoever their oppressive, culturally irrelevant dogmas say they're allowed to, and it will legally amount to bupkus, and we will all stand around and snicker about the pointlessness of it.

Culturally irrelevant? Tell that to the billions who follow a religion. Tell that to the millions who don't and are oppressed because of it.
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